Please Yell at this Tundra Noob

I’m new to Toyota, but used to getting deep in the weeds with specifics on cars I obsess over.

Tl;dr when you were new in the market for a 2.5gen, what did you wish you knew; and what have you learned since then?

the long story:
My “forever car” got t-boned by some kid running a stop sign, and after seeing a gen3 I ended up at the Toyota dealership that day just to look. Originally drawn to the gen3 but the engines blowing up drove me to test drive a 2.5 and I fell in love. I bought a $650 Toyota echo off an old couple, and I’ve been daily driving it as enjoying its simplicity, realizing I don’t actually need majority of the fancy stuff. It just serves me zero help with the wife and kids, but it gets me to and from work on the cheap.

The 2.5 platform seems somewhat unique across its run. From what I’m picking up 2014-2017 is like your standard run half/cycle update with the introduction of the TRD pro specifically for practical purposes toward the end. Then the TSS is introduced in 2018 on, with the trans coolers falling off 2019+ model year. 2020 sees Apple plug in CarPlay, with 2021 working over the air entirely.

I’m noticing what I want is hens teeth, but I’ve been on the hunt for a white gen2.5 crewmax 4x4 with leather (or fake leather) interior with less than 70k miles, and I know I’ll likely have to pay the “reliability tax” to get what I want. Much of what I see for sale are going for a premium even with 1-2 accidents on record. I know enough about body work to be dangerous, and usually can at least identify the quality of repair and generally be able to see what was damaged. I also know headlights, grilles, and bumpers can be swapped to whatever I think looks better, and I find myself pretty much locked on to a limited, 1794, or platinum.

I’ve got no problem driving off into the sunset in my $650 car until I find the right truck, but I want to feel most informed before I pull the trigger. I’ve spent hours and hours reading through this forum in the last month, but I know many of you have years and years of hands-on experience.

 

To be honest, I'm not sure that you need a whole lot more information than you already have. The larger fuel tank on the TRD Off Road was a must for me, but that's personal preference. I would say to avoid a Flex Fuel truck if you can. There's a number of threads about how the Flex Fuel system can get the Alcohol% wrong, which will lead to decreased MPG. It's not the end of the world for me, since I'm fine buying a bidirectional scan gauge to reset it in my driveway, but again, a factor. Other than that, it seems like you're on the right track to land yourself a new truck!

 

Thanks for this tip! I’ve noticed some popping up in my search. Previously on here I had seen some people just saying they run them with regular gas in them and it’s fine; but I do think I’d be more comfortable avoiding them all together. I don’t even think we have any flex fuel options offered in my area anyway.

 

If you're not looking for a lot of bells and whistles and want the lowest cost config that meets your above criteria, an SR5 with leather added (many came this way or are a Katzkin kit away) or a limited would get you there. I'll second the no flex fuel, they can be a pain. Miles mean less than location, don't be afraid to buy one with even 100k or so miles. Buying from the rust belt is a bad idea, find one with a clean frame to start. The LED OEM headlights are very nice compared to the halogen OEMs. The larger tank is a must.

 

First off... welcome to the forum!

Most of your research is correct, but 'with 2021 working over the air entirely' is inaccurate... 2021s are wired Carplay also, but most of us are running wireless dongles that cost about $80 and work great (in fact on my '21 Pro I have less connectivity/re-connect issues than I did when I had my phone connected directly

Anyhow, coming from an '08 (which i bought new and still have) w/over 280k miles, I'll say this...

I prefer just putting a key in the ignition and worrying about less electronics and nannies over the perceived 'convenience' of the technology, but those rigs are getting older and maintenance and parts are more expensive and getting harder to find.

With my '21 some of the creature comforts are nice and I like more than I thought I would (like adaptive cruise). However, it will do some weird shit sometimes and pick up cars in adjacent lanes (multi-lane fwys) and slam on the brakes for you unexpectedly... I also hate most of the TSS stuff like the constant beeping that occurs when you open and close doors (shopping run, loading the vehicle, etc.) it drives me freakin' nuts (but it was part of their safety push to prevent leaving a child in the car after parking it I think

But, I will say that it also saved my bacon once.... when a dude on a bike shot across the road from behind a car, in the middle of the street I had just turned onto, without stopping or looking first and the system activated and slammed on the brakes (hard); as I was reacting to scenario and as my foot was moving to the brake pedal, the car was already stopped (impressive)...

Anyhow, you're spot on w/the rest of your research; find a well cared for 2.5 Gen that's had proper maintenance done w/the features you're looking for and you're gonna be happy. The 1794 have the nicest interiors and softest 'leathers' (personally I don't care for the interior colors on most) but they are nice and should have most of the features you are after.

CrewMax (huge cab short bed) or DoubleCab (smaller back seat and longer bed) are your only other considerations really...

Be patient, and you'll find the perfect truck; plus prices are coming down now and should continue to do so....

Good luck!!!

 

Don't let leather lock you into a higher trim. You can get an SR5 well equipped and add aftermarket leather for less than the price difference in trim.

One thing to know is that the LSD isn't a true LSD diff. It's simulated using the brakes. Don't get me wrong, it works pretty well, but it's not a true LSD. The OEM LEDs are worth it and better than aftermarket. Get a package that has them or plan to add them. The larger fuel tank didn't start to show up until the 2016 model year and if you plan to tow I would say it's a must have.

If you are still going to go with a higher trim for the leather to be OEM, then look for a Windchill Pearl instead of white. The white from Toyota has peeling issues, and I don't think the Windchill Pearl has those issues.

 

I agree with the advice to avoid flex fuel trucks, and the larger fuel tank is worth it even if it eats some payload.

I’m not sure there is much that is “practical” about the Pro…it is a set of better shocks, an exhaust, and an appearance package (bed stamp, unique color, grille, floor mats). Higher resale? Sure, but higher price of entry as well, so I think it’s kind of a wash. Only in the later years did the Pro get leather seats and seat heaters, which I consider to be the only functional difference between an SR5 and a Limited.

I’m in a ‘21 SR5 with the TRD OR package. No sunroof. My CarPlay is wired. The TSS doesn’t bug me much. I did add a transmission cooler. I am also not a tech guy. But I must say, I appreciate the dual climate and LED headlights added by the TRD OR package. The auto-dimming feature works really well, too. I have cloth seats but may add leather and heaters at some point. The thing is, my cloth is never too hot nor too cold.

Why don’t you find the cleanest, accident free, lowest mileage white Limited truck and build it how you want? Or if you find an SR5 that meets all your requirements, you can add leather and seat heaters.

 

The larger tank is definitely on my must list. I know I can add the LED OEM lights, and likely would do so if it didn’t have it. I’m in NC and have been checking all the histories on prospective cars to ensure they didn’t spend time in the north. I grew up in MD and when I moved down here I couldn’t believe how much longer cars lasted, and how much easier they were to work on. Thanks for all your tips, I’m updating my personal list with your advice.

 

Forgot this one, but it is a game changer for a truck that gets between 13-15mpg.... So, like @GODZILLA said...

The larger fuel tank didn't start to show up until the 2016 model year and if you plan to tow I would say it's a must have.

 

You clearly need to start showing my 'bed stamp' more respect...

 

If it helps, my 2009 LX 570 has push-button start and 5 smart handles (4 doors + rear liftgate), and it all still works flawlessly after 15 years and 176k miles.

Plus, I have a cool credit card key.

I think the bed stamp is very cool, especially when left alone without any letter inserts.

It’s the hood scoop I don’t like. It takes the truck from no scoops to two scoops.

 

Thanks for these tips, I think I’ll be aiming for 2016-2021 with what you’ve stated. From building cars in the past I’m very “OEM or OEM equivalent” oriented, and I know it’s better to buy right than to buy twice. The wife is the one kind of pushing hard for the leather, and she’s the final approval stamp because she has a hip injury so I need her to be comfortable in the seat. My other car didn’t agree with her, some comfortable seats is how I win her over to get into my truck.

I’m definitely going to have to read into the LSD stuff more. If I tow it would likely be a utility trailer and a lawn mower, but we have discussed starting to camp (we have beach parks we can drive out on, or go out west to the mountains) as the kids get a little older. I know these aren’t tow hogs so if we do end up with a camper, it would be small; but still on the list of possibilities of capabilities. Obviously I would add the trans cooler for my own personal satisfaction if I buy a later year.

Thanks for adding your input, it is definitely building on to the considerations I have as well as things I didn’t consider.

 

Yeah, they struggle to tow larger trailers

 

Echoing @Tripleconpanna , @Terndrerrr , and @KNABORES recommendations.

I also have done exactly what you're (seemingly) wanting to. I got into an SR5; I didn't want a sunroof. I wanted a Crew max for seating/interior comfort and the rear window is badass. 4x4 (ended up buying TRD OR wheels from another member because they are the best looking wheels imo.) 38gal tank was a must. I dont mind the TSS/radar cruise (once I figured out how to bypass/workaround); Tow package wasn't necessary, but the trailer brake comes in handy when I occasionally tow heavy-ish. I dont tow long distances so adding the trans cooler back hasn't been necessary for me. Most of when I tow ambient temps don't break 60 anyways so that helps a little.

I added:
aftermarket leather heated seats (more comfortable than limited leather seats by my own test driving and many others on here confirming).
auto up/down windows for all 4. Only possible on SR5 as limiteds have front 2 windows already auto up/down and the aftermarket unit won't work.
OEM PRO LED Headlights. Best dollar for dollar upgrade we can do on these trucks.
Fox 2.0 coilovers* set at 1" lift upfront, and Bilstein 5100s with no lift in the rear. 285/70/18 Recon Grapplers. Great setup for my needs.
Diode Dynamics SS3 Pro amber/yellow fogs (needed during our whiteouts).

One thing I wouldn't mind that the limited has that I don't is the dual climate. Not a huge dealbreaker though.

Sounds like you're well-researched. Good luck.


*more on this in another post

 

regarding the TRD pro, I can agree with what you say. I think “practical” was the wrong choice of words on my part, I kind of meant that it lacked some of the fancier creature-comfort stuff outside of what you listed. For the price I can get a lower trim and build it up to what appearances I can appreciate from it, just as you suggest. Kind of had me scratching my head when I saw the premium price they carried and no heated seats/leather in some. I know what it really is (a marketing ploy), and I’ve seen other manufacturers do it; but I have nothing against people who buy them. They still look cool.

My echo has cloth now. Haven’t had cloth seats and a while but from the time I’ve been in it I don’t have major gripes other than wear and tear. Wife is pretty adamant about the leather though, especially with the kids, but I’ll compromise where I can.

 

Any issues? I have stayed away from that unit everyone is buying because I’ve read multiple times that it is buggy or doesn’t last very long.

You can get this on an SR5 with the TRD Off road package. I was agnostic on it, but the first time my wife cranked her side up to 74 while I stayed at 68, I became a believer.

 

I love the credit card key, I saw the gen3 guys have figured out how to do it with their trucks. Keyless entry is always nice, but my echo kind of showed me it’s not as much of a deal breaker as it once was for me. I guess there’s some nostalgia in still cranking the engine over.

 

I’ve had dual climate on a handful of cars now and we never really seem to use it. The wife and I usually always seem to have it synch’d and can be civil about a shared temperature. I also like the idea of no sunroof to be honest. It’s like a fireplace… everyone wants one but most people don’t even use it. Dealt with sunroof leaks in the past that were a nightmare too.

mind sharing what seats you went with?

 

I'll second a lot of what other people are saying on here. SR5 and the 38 gal tank were important to me. Flex fuel doesn't bother me because I don't think ill ever use it. The rest I added on my own. Wireless android auto with a new headunit from a vendor here on the forum that provided everything I needed plug and play. Katskinz replacement upholstery which is very doable on your own if you take your time and have some DIY ability otherwise local upholstery shops will put the kits in pretty reasonably. While I had the seats apart I added heated seats off Amazon and they work fantastic. Everything else is personal preference and there are TONS of great write ups on here.

I personally don't like :
Cars with sunroofs just because drains get clogged and you get weird leaks, esp if you park outside. I'm not saying the tundra is prone to clogs, I just avoid sun roofs if I can. cars I've had with them I always tint 5% light pass.
Bumper sensors, blind spot monitoring but they can be handy in specific situations.

I personally like the adaptive cruise, I don't use it all the time but it is nice in specific situations. I have had the automatic braking system kick on once and it probably saved me from a minor fender bender.

Only concern for me with 2018 and newer is no trans cooler but unless you have some steep grade, high ambient temps and heavy trailers I don't think its a huge issue. Worth doing drain and fills on the trans every 30-60k. there are kits that you can add trans coolers back in fairly easily. That being said. these trucks are generally super reliable. Look for cam tower leaks, mild weeping is generally not an issue that needs to be fixed. See if you can get certified preowned if you are worried about it. Stay away from salt belt vehicles if you can for used, look for frame rust if you have to (tap with a hammer), and if you drive in the salt belt do some kind of oil or wax based undercoating. that and oil changes and the truck will last a very long time.

Oh, and if you are in an area with mice/park outside its worth getting some kind of peppermint oil to spray under the hood and there are write ups on how to mesh off a spot under the lower windshield cowl to keep pests out of your cabin air filter. personally I just spray with peppermint oil and change the filter every 6 months with an amazon subscription for cabin air filters. This is an issue with all newer cars due to soy based wiring insulation.

**Edit - I forgot to mention 4WD was a must for me as well.

 

The first run of units were buggy/spotty. Mine died within 2 weeks. Contacted the company, and including timezone and language barriers they had a new unit back to me at no cost within a week or 10 days of when I first reached out to them. It's been flawless ever since. I do keep the original "unit" in the console with a trim tool just in case... fool me once, as they say. (Swapping back to the original unit takes less than 5minutes and fixes the issue immediately); I think the units that started shipping after July of 2022 have been mostly trouble free.

I think that's a MY 20/21 only feature (just like coming with OEM LED Headlights), but I could be wrong.

 

I apologize I completely overlooked this post, but definitely some solid info here I really appreciate. The wife has a newer car with similar safety features so we have experienced some of the quirks, but I know they’re different brand to brand. Even the idea it can save me from an insurance debacle in a situation you described is kind of appealing.

Definitely noticed the trucks aren’t moving as fast lately and prices are coming down. As long as time is on my side hopefully things will become more ideal. Had some fun at a Buick dealership negotiating on a 2019 Tundra a week ago telling them I’d pay 38 out the door two weeks ago, and they got huffy and puffy about it. They still have it, so I should pop in again just to annoy them some more.

 

Oh wow, definitely some solid advice I really appreciate. I didn’t realize the wiring was soy based. I have a 100+acre large farm behind me that grows soybeans occasionally, but a large ditch between us keeps most pests at bay. I have Bermuda grass I keep super short, which helps as well since they can’t hide. What I do know, between the farm and the fact I fertilize the yard with soybean meal, is the fact that a lot of pests and rodents are attracted to soybean. This is why I only buy when I fertilize and never store it, because many people who do so end up having rodent problems. That being said, I can understand why they would be attracted to the wiring in that case. I saw the one post where a squirrel totaled the guys truck out.

 

It's ALEA leather. I picked them up never installed/ or used from a forum member here (he does some installs, and his customer either didn't like the color or they were ordered for a CrewMAx and the customer needed DC - I cant remember specifics) and had them installed locally. He said that the "big 3" were katzkin, Clazzio, ALEA; I had only heard of Katzkin, etc. and he indicated that these were a little thicker and likely more durable longterm. I've never seen others installed (so I can't speak to those), but the leather has been rock solid for going on 2 years now. And, very comfortable right out of the gate. They're a beige/tan which I love and it's not something Toyota offers, particularly with MGM - so I liked that aspect as well.

 

Thanks for detailing all of that for me. I’m definitely going to make note of this as options. I had only been tracking Katzkin, so this definitely adds some variety.

 

No worries; I'm glad to see that you are getting some good info here.

Touching base on creature comforts for your wife... Keep her happy, and your truck budget will go up an easy 5-10k

No seriously, regarding heated seats... She wouldn't say it, but they are a must for her. I wouldn't have a '21 Pro right now if they didn't upgrade them to heated seats, which I think happened in '20 or '21 . I remember looking at 4Runners back in 2019 and at the time the Pros did not have a passenger side power seat (which meant no up/down or seat tilt) kinda weird some of the shit they do w/that trim. Another example is that my '21 Pro has adaptive cruise, automatic on/off high beams, heated seats, adjustable headlights (part of the tow package), but no driver's seat memory (so if the wife drives, which is seldom, but still... ) to get my seat back into position... The creature features on the trims you were looking at seem to be much more inclusive and consistent than the Pro trim.

Oh, LED headlights are a must; most folks that don't have them want them and swap them out for LEDs when they can (OE or quality headlights are $$$).

Also, I wouldn't walk from the perfect truck that checks all the boxes just because it has a sunroof... my '08 has one (so does the '21 Pro), and I've never had a leak issue. Yes, the sunroof drains can clog (I've cleaned the ones in my '08 twice), but it's only a 15-20 minute job w/some basic string trimmer line through the 4 ports at the corners of the sunroof and a little water to be sure it flows

Finally, regarding the whole 4WD, LSD, traction control thing... the video on this post will get you started w/understanding how it works:
36

Just important to know this is a 4WD truck not an AWD truck (so many folks get into these and think they should be able to run 60mph in 4WD on ice w/it because it has 4WD)

The system is very reliable, predictable and well functioning as long as you understand how it works. There are numerous threads that have been started, commented on and added to that talk about the system, and some have bad, inaccurate or misleading info in them.

 

I agree with most of your post but one minor correction. 2018 did have the trans cooler, 2019 and later did not.

I bought a new 2018 in January of that year. First year of TSS and there were several software recalls to clear out some bugs. Personally I have NO USE for the "nannies" and have turned almost all of them off (most permanently, one - PCS - I have to turn off manually ever time I start the truck). RCTA (Rear Cross Traffic Alert) is fantastic, I use it when backing out of parking places all the time when visibility is limited, even picks up small kids and shopping carts on the move out of view. Most important features to me:

1) 38 gallon tank.
2) LED headlights.
3) I went with DC for the longer bed (no kids, they have all grown and gone). CM will work best if you have rear passengers.

There are many features that are personal choices and many come with certain packages, that was true in my case. I am totally happy with my Tundra, runs like new even after 6 years and 85,000 miles. In my case being 2wd, I get between 16-18 mpg at all times - running around town or hitting the highway.

Good luck on your search and keep us up to date!

Dan

 

Works on our trucks with the push button start as well:
https://www.tundras.com/threads/lexus-credit-card-key-works-in-2020-tundra.70321/

 

oooo… this alone might sell me on a MY20/21 haha. Thank you for sharing the link, I’m definitely going to save that info.

 

Haha, sometimes it’s the little things. If my wife had a dollar every time I said something like this, she could probably buy me a truck outright.