How do airbags feel at low PSIs?

When not towing/hauling and airbags are set to low pressure (5-10), will the rear end ride harsh, and will there be any change in height? I have the stock TRD OR suspension in the back and sit pretty level now (5100 + CB shim front) on a '21 CM.

I had airbags in my F150 and it rode like a dump truck when unloaded. But to be fair, I also had those airbags set to a higher PSI so that it had the rake I wanted.

I am aware of other solutions (RAS, Sumo, Deaver, Alcan, AAL, etc.) but am specifically curious about how airbags feel when not towing/hauling. I sit level now and it looks okay, so not looking to add height per say but leery of the dump truck feel.

Thanks!

 

Yes to both, slight/minimal height raise at low psi and air bags feel like, well, air bags. They will not ride as well unloaded as the truck does without them.

 

I set my Firestones at 7 psi and feel no difference in ride quality, no height difference either. If I go to 10 and beyond there is definitely a difference in both areas.

 

Bingo, thanks! That is exactly what I wanted to know, I appreciate the input.

 

Yeah about 10 is where things start raising up with my bags. I bought my truck from someone who didn't know they were there and it just rode on the internal airbag bump stops. The only thing that was suboptimal with this other than cosmetic ride height was that I felt a fair amount of bed bounce. I prefer the ride with about 30, 35 lbs in there. That's enough to remove the squat from most of my tow jobs.

 

I’ve got an Airlift Wireless One system for my bags, so set pressure for each condition I drive under. All that means is that I always run em at 5# when empty, as it’s just a tap of a button to dump the air.
I’ve got Deaver U748 springs with ADS smoothies in the rear, and my ride is awesome. I do have slightly my damping on rebound than typical from ADS, because of the bags. Without this, I’d be concerned about them bucking the rear a bit on harder hits.
The bags really shine when I hook up to my 20’ flatbed trailer with my tractor on it. Less important with my travel trailer, as it uses a weight distributing hitch.

 

I had a set of AirLift bags on my 2015. The truck rode the garbage. I took them off and put on a set of SumoSprings. Much better ride and they did the job.

 

Mine were the same. Internal jounce bumper was always hitting. Almost swapped out my Kings thinking they were the problem. Popped them out, and haven't looked back.

 

Without a load, I can always feel that the airbags are back there. The rear end just feels slightly bouncy and floaty, regardless of how low I go with the PSI (they need to have at least 5psi to keep from damaging the bags). Because of the amount of off-roading I do, I installed Daystar cradles with them. The cradles are at least an inch thick between the bottom of the airbag and the leaf spring bracket. I wonder if this has anything to do with it. Been meaning to try something else (RAS most likely), but haven’t had any time.

 

Mine had the cradles as well. Maybe because my truck is only leveled with the Kings and the rears are stock, they just sat on the jounce bumpers. I had more than a few passengers say how bad of a ride was in the back seat.

 

I modified my airlift bags to be setup like a cradle, and even physically disconnected the air lines and the ride was still considerably worse than before, to the point I take the bags off unless I'm towing something heavy enough to justify them (over 5000lbs or so).

 

I have the AirLift bags and run the recommended 5 psi. No difference in ride quality when empty. HUGE difference when towing. Nice and flat.

 

Is your rear pretty low? My ride was shit with the bags till I went to lifted springs. There was such a small space for the bags to fit, they didn't have much room to compress. Now with no load and 5# in the bags, they're just barely sitting in the cradles. I can't say the ride is better than without bags, but it's not shitty by any means. I do believe that when my Tundra is no longer my tow vehicle, the bags will come off and be replaced with hydraulic bumps.

 

Not really, it has 3-4" of lift and sounds similar to yours where there's a 1/2" gap maybe between the cradle and bag. I agree I wouldn't call it shitty, but definitely noticeable over fast dips and anything that makes the suspension compress quickly. Feels like the suspension bottoms out, where as with the bags off there's plenty of up travel remaining.

 

So, do you run with no bumps if your bags are out? I’m scared to fuck up a spring…

 

Yea, ironically I have other things with hydros but I'm lazy so will just rely on the Kings getting slammed to town

 

Firestone RideRite 5 PSI unloaded(*) w/ daystar cradles. TRD Off-Road Bilstein shocks. Little stiffer over stock, but I think it's an overall positive due to the reduction in body roll. I would still describe it as a relatively soft riding truck. Rides GREAT when loaded up to GVWR (no trailer), however, even without adding any air over the 5 PSI baseline when unloaded(*). I've had a RAM 1500 Classic loaded up to GVWR and it squirmed like Jello salad on the highway. The Tundra is very stable.

(*)I probably have 300 pounds over stock in the bed at all times from the topper, bedrug, rubber mat, and various tools I carry around. Your experience may vary if your "unloaded" weight is a bare bed.

 

The fix for sway is more air in the air bags. For bounce at the rear axle the fix is to add a good sway bar like the Hellwig one for the Tundra. I added one to my truck and the improvement was dramatic with the bed empty. With a heavy load the fix was adding SuperSprings.

 

Thanks for the input, everyone, I appreciate it.

I went with blue Sumo Springs. Easy installation, no fussing with bag pressure, the price was right, and there are all sorts of positive comments and reviews on the interwebs. I just installed them and the unloaded ride is great! I won't have a chance to try them loaded+towing until next weekend, but really, it can't sag much worse than stock.

 

I'd be very interested in hearing when Sumo Springs actually come into play or how much approximate weight is required for them to begin "working" in comparison to a truck without them.
For example if the truck had 500lbs in the bed factory setup squat vs 500 lbs with Sumo squat difference.
I just did a level lift with 2.5 Elka's set at 1.75" approx and would like to keep the bed from sagging with a light trailer tongue weight of 350lbs.

 

Take this with a grain of salt, but I've been schlepping around a lot of random stuff in the bed of my truck this summer. Before the Sumo Springs, I observed up to a 2" squat with perhaps ~300-400 pounds in the bed. That's a guess on the weight, but probably not too far off. After I added the Sumo Springs, and with similar loads, I observed no noticeable squat. The truck feels great and I'm super pleased with this purchase. YMMV.

 

Ended up swapping to RAS. Absolutely love it. No more bouncy, floaty rear end when empty (“empty” being a full tool box, 2nd battery, retractable bed cover, and axe/shovel combo). If I set it lightly, I still get good articulation off-road. If I crank it up, it feels like I have a rear sway bar installed. Haven’t towed with it yet, but very impressed so far.

 

I can't feel any difference when not aired up to at least 20 psi.

 

Mine were bouncy all the way down to 5psi unless loaded with 800+ lbs. I really do think the cradles contributed a lot to that.

 

Good to hear and thanks for the feedback.
It looks like these trucks would require longer shackles with this setup. Wondering if the Toytec extended shackles would be an option.

 

Interesting concept and some guys seem to like them.
I've used hellwig helpers in the past which seemed to work ok on a half ton and the price was right.

 

I had a set on my 2015 after I removed the LiftRite airbags that rode like crap.
Empty they were about ½" from contacting the frame.
With my ARE CX cap on (about 180 pounds) they were very nearly in contact with the frame.
The black ones will support 1,000 pounds at 50% deflection which is about 3.5". The stock springs will support about 600 pounds at that deflection as well. So, at 1,600 pounds you will see about 3.5" to 4" of deflection.
I could put my travel trailer (750 pounds) on the hitch without WDH (only for around the yard) and it would deflect maybe 2".
They rode WAY better than bags and did significantly reduce the travel of the suspension when loaded.
IMO they are the best option for passive suspension help. They are very easy to remove if you don't want them. I would buy a second set and cut them down for bump stops when you are not in the heavy hauling business. You can swap them out in about 5 minutes.

All that to say, they DID limit rear suspension travel. It did ride firmer than it did without them. I am not putting them on my Pro!

Suspension squat is not a bad thing. It just means that you have suspension. On an off road vehicle you actually want suspension that deflects or your butt will have to make up the difference.

 

Did you ever try the bags without cradles before moving to RAS? I have cradles but really don't need them, this has me curious about ride quality without them.

 

I didn’t. I off-road too much to not run the cradles.

 

Not using cradles kills the droop. This makes the ride even worse.