Resolution: adjust caster after repl 2883's - pulling right over washboard bumps

2-3 times in the last 3 weeks I've hit a very rough patch of road and my truck seemed to float/move an inch or 2 (guessing here) to one side or the other. This is in the front end.

Never experienced this before

I've not yet replaced the upper ball joints or either of the control arm bushings. From what I've read, this could be a sign that the upper ball joints are going bad?

Edit to add: I did all the tests and visual checks last October when I replaced the lower ball joints and the bushings and upper ball joints and bushings seemed to be OK at that time

done the OEM LBJ's, bilstein 5100 shocks, 2883 coils, steering rack, inner and outer TRE's. Not aware of any other part that would normally be replaced in the steering and suspension

otherwise, the truck is driving and riding fantastic

 

Stock UCAs?

 

Yes

 

How much lift in front?
No alignment issues with stock UCAs?
Anything over 2" front lift I'd highly recommend aftermarket UCA's to correct the front end geometry. As a bonus they'd include their own upper BJs.

 

No. Just got it realigned today using assassins recommendations and seems to ride and handle a lot better with no scrubbing now

I just raised it another inch moving it to the second notch on the bilsteins in the front. I'm not sure the shock coil combo raised a full inch but the last change did seem to raise it a full inch. In other words it should be no more than 2 inches max probably a little less.

I was about to say I'm sure this happened before I raised it another inch but it's late and I'm tired and now I'm doubting myself

 

I don't know about the 5100's paired with lift coils on these trucks, but I know on the first gen taco's people always recommend not setting the 5100's above the bottom notch.
Hopefully someone else can chime in.

Just some quick googling and I'm seeing mixed answers as to how much lift the 2883's provide our trucks and I can't even find em for our trucks on ARB's website. Weird.

Either way, there are some affordable UCAs worth checking out that probably won't be too much more than buying two OEM upper BJs. Check out KSP and Freedom Off-road for budget friendly UCAs.

 

Josh at 1stgenoffroad said it would be around 8/10 to 9/10 of an inch on the very bottom perch with the 2883's. He thought I would have no problem going to that second notch but I know it gets rough if you go to the third or fourth

 

I just took another look at the alignment specs from today. It's an improvement And I know they struggled with it a little bit, but I did I have concerns over a few of these numbers.

@assassin10000 is that difference in caster between the left and right side enough to cause concern?

 

I'm thinking you're on the right track with the bushings and ubjs.
But again KSP and Freedom Off-road UCAs will include New bushings and ubjs. Might give you some piece of mind at an affordable price point.
Obviously you'd need to realign after installing those UCAs.

Also, did you realign it after going up a notch?

 

They did an alignment after that move to the 2nd perch. However, they did not do it correctly. The numbers were way off, but I told him to hold off because I was replacing the steering rack.

So today's alignment was after the lift and the steering rack

 

For what it's worth, my truck also walks back and forth over washboard. And ABS has a penchant for kicking in while braking in chunky patches.

Not saying it's normal, but it's something I've also observed. It also did it before lifting and oversizing tires, but it's more noticeable after lifting.

I've noticed similar with damn near every vehicle I've lowered also. Stiffer suspension tends to float a bit over bumps.

 

yes, I would call this a washboard type of bump spot in the road. A series of very quick bumps over a A few feet

It may have done it a little bit before, but now that I'm more awake, I believe it got worse when I raised it up another inch very recently

I was just thinking maybe the lift was putting a little more stress on what may be a worn upper ball joint

 

Alignment will also impact how you handle bumps. Did you notice it more after the added inch of lift, or after cranking up the caster? Just something to think about.

 

Now that I'm rested, it was after that lift. They did an alignment, but it was out of spec I told him to hold off because I was Replacing the Steering rack.

But now the steering rack has been replaced, they did a more correct alignment, not entirely within assassins's specifications I could tell it drove and handled much better however, I ran across another washboard series of bumps while driving it last night and that walking issue remained

 

I'm gonna put my $$ on this.

You're just running stiffer suspension. Also by moving up a clip you're making it THAT much stiffer. The more preload you add to the spring the more weight it will require to compress. If the spring doesn't compress, the shock can't do its job which is absorb those shit bumps.

if you want that "float of whoops" kinda suspension. You need to soften the springs up some. It's a double edged sword. On one case you're using the spring stiffness to add height, on the other hand, the stiffness negates ride quality.

what you describe as "sudden shifting left/right over bumps" is what we call "bump steer" in the track world. It's ESPECIALLY bad in FF track cars. So front end suspension is mad sophisticated for those vehicles.

 

that's kind of what I was suspecting since it started with that last lift

If I had known, I probably should've gotten longer springs other than the 2883's But at the time I thought 1 inch lift would be sufficient

I may end up getting the longer springs When I do the upper ball joint and control arm bushings, and or upper control arm hopefully not until next year

 

Yea, taller/softer springs would be the best way to get the ride you're looking for.

guess it's prerunner time

 

yeah, I think I edited that post after you replied, but if my upper upper ball joints are OK I'll probably replace the springs, ball joints, and if needed upper control arms next year



I just want to be sure that right now it is not pending upper ball joint failure

 

I thought the 2883's were only 590lb spring rate. I think that's pretty close to stock.
Most lifts are either 650lb or 700lb coils on our trucks.
I'm standing by my previous statement that I've always read to only lift Bilstein clips on stock coils.
I think just taller springs, on the bottom clip, but I doubt you can go much softer without going LT.

 

that would be my assumption as well.

looks like a 1-2" taller 600lbs spring would be ideal. But I think you'll have to look into the stroke of the shocks as well to see if they'll be cycling properly.

honestly, it would just be easier to go LT

 

Get outta here!

 

.6° off side to side isn't good but not terrible. If you're not getting any pull, then I wouldn't worry too much (hands off steering wheel, flat road at 45+ and it goes to the left or right too fast).

Many cars come with a .8° or 1.0° side to side split.

 

So far, that's what I've experienced so suspected it was OK. But I'll know better after driving a little bit more this weekend

PS @assassin10000 my shop was impressed and they took notes for future alignments with lifted tundras

 

Excuse my ignorance. LT?

 

I told Josh I was wanting about 1 inch of lift. Might end up going to 2 inches later
He told me on my double cab that that's about what I would get maybe around .8 or .9 inches and that is about what I got. Obviously YMMV

now some of that could've been based on the fact that my factory springs had 300,000 miles and were 18 years old. I just know what he told me and I know that's what I got over what I had at the time.

but now that I know I am sitting exactly where I need to be height/lift wise I will probably replace with a more appropriate spring next year and go back to bottom perch along with replacing my leaf springs

 

yessir, I just looked it up and 590 lbs is correct

 

if I had known all of this, I would've gone ahead and replaced the springs. I was just going on what Josh at 1stgen said. And before reading this thread, I was pretty sure I had mostly read the first or second perch was OK just do not go to the third or fourth. But now that I know I'll take care of that next year

My measurement from center hub to the bottom of the flare was originally about 20 inches which is in line with others that I've read. With the 2883's it was roughly 20-7/8". Now it is 21-7/8". And I'm sure with my measurements there is about a quarter inch margin of error in either direction


As always, I appreciate everyone's advice and insights. Incredible experience and help on these forums. I either learn something new every time or learn how little I know

 

I could be wrong about the perch settings. My knowledge on the subject of 5100's and perch settings is from my experience with first gen Tacomas. Do your research to be sure.

 

Well, it's obvious it had a negative effect on mine. But what I described in this thread so far is the only thing I've noticed negative.

but it is enough I would spend a few hundred dollars to get more appropriate springs


And like I said, I appreciate you and everyone's insight. Helps me learn

 

LT = Long Travel