Replacing LBJ's front shocks/coil overs

I think I’ve sorted through everything, but still a little confused on the torque specs. Some of that may be the difference between the 06 and earlier, some of it maybe because I couldn’t read that diagram very well, and I don’t know if there’s any difference between 2WD & 4WD on the parts I’m replacing

47 - 3 top front shock bolts
100 - bottom shock bolt

either 48 or 59 - 4 LBJ studs
Edited to say this was discussed in another forum post a few years back. I believe they concluded it should be 59 which makes sense from what I read.

either 103 or 117 - LBJ crown nut w/ cotter pin

67 - lbj/tie rod end w/ crown and cotter pin

14 - (top) stabilizer bar link to stabilizer
51 - (bottom) stabilizer to LCA/LSA

83-85 - lug nuts


With the 4 LBJ studs: the video I watched and one of the two diagrams both said 48 foot pounds. But there is another image in that diagram that appears to be 59. I’m assuming I’m misreading one of the diagrams

I’m going with the lower numbers in both cases unless I’m told differently

 

Oh jeez you're right. The 1st and 3rd image here taken from the same FSM are showing different values. How whack is that?

Well, I went 50ftlb on the LBJ bolts, with blue Loctite. 50 because trying to dial in 48, my eyes are getting too old to fine-tune. I used a Testors yellow paint marker to draw a line marking bolt head positions onto the LBJ so I could inspect in 100, 500, 1k miles, at every oil change/tire rotation to to verify they hadn't backed out any from my install.

Anything with a crown nut is OK to [torque to spec + up to 1/6th turn] with the extra 60° turn being used to line up the cotter hole. That's not coming from me, that's from Dad, who spent 20yrs as a USN airplane mech. May be a mechanical standard with cars too, dunno.

And now I'm curious about the torque discrepancies.

 

If there’s a tool for the ball joints and ball joint to tie rod end, then there should be a tool to lower / expand this lower control/suspension arm

I watched that video of Josh. I can’t even get that close.

speaking of Josh, ha ha, at including a 10 mm socket in the package. Well done




Another Frankenstein contraption, but it worked

I made sure there were no brake lines or anything in the way of the frame



before I go too far, what in the heck are these for?



Success with one shock

 

Down to my last nut on the side. Yes I can jack up the LCA/LSA. And I know under normal circumstances it would never go that low (unless your left tire ran off in a deep hole or possibly on a lift). BUT

if I’m interpreting this correctly this means that the one bolt/stud on the tie rod and is the primary support / stop when it goes that low. It seems like it would just snap

edited to add: and if this thing hangs down this low, how the hell are you ever going to jack up the front to change your tire? This was originally high enough to takeoff my front tire. The rotor is now about 7 inches off the ground

 

I’ve jacked the LCA/LCS so high in the rod will snow not fit into the ball joint. High enough that it is raised about 3/4 inch above my jack stand. That jack stand was set high enough to remove my front tire.



i’m honestly afraid to finish and lower. Something just doesn’t seem right in the geometry but I can’t imagine it is anything I did

it is like the new shock and coil will not compress. it is now jacked up high enough so that the tire would be 2 inches off the ground

 

Am I jacking it from the wrong place to raise the LCA/LCS?

 

That's ballpark where I was jacking from. Maybe I'm missing something? What's the problem? Something binding?

 

The tie rod end will not fit up into its place on the ball joint because it is still angled too sharply

edit: #%$

 

Dumb questions but.. is your sway bar disconnected? If not, that will make it very difficult to articulate the suspension where you need it to stab the end link to the knuckle. Also, did you verify your geometry is the same with the overall length of your new tie rod end link? Those seem like about the only things that could be holding you up at this point, assuming they are all the correct parts.

 

Dammit never mind

just had to rotate the outer tie rod end

 

And you may need to adjust it outbound so it can reach where it needs to be. I typically only jack up one side so the weight on the other tire keeps the wheel from turning, that way you can better ballpark the alignment for limited change.

I was about to ask you to get me an overall shot from roughly this angle so I can see the relationship of everything... in case there's anything we're missing. But sounds like you got it now. The other side will be easier! It always is.

​

 

Success, and finished with that side. Yes I hope the other side goes much easier. I’ve learned from a few mistakes

A picture below of it finished of course now I immediately don’t know why I was scared of lifting it more than 1 inch. But I may change that next year when I get some new tires and wheels

 

First off, congratulations. You did it. That deserves credit. You have balls bigger than some on here who absolutely refuse to learn/do on their own, and that's nothing to scoff at.

I'll be shocked if the other side takes you more than 60mins of actual effort if you're at a good clip. 2hr if you take your time. But all in all, you know what worked on the other side, so you'll just be mirroring that. Don't let your confidence have you forgetting steps though, it's a classic rookie mistake!

As a sanity check, once you get the other side done, and the truck is on the ground, I recommend going back over, double-check the torque on everything that doesn't have a cotter in it. If it helps, print out the FSM picture with torque values, then use a highlighter to highlight each thing you touched.

The new suspension will settle in over a few days/few dozen miles. Set a reminder for yourself to re-check torque one last time on everything 100 miles out, 500 miles out. I know some dudes on here will say "shifty, that's overkill!", but especially as a n00b, safety is pinnacle, habits like this are good!

Always a good idea too, as I said before, to mark bolt heads with a paint marker so that after that 500 mile check-up, you can quickly and easily have a visual indication later whether anything backed out, and no need to break out the torque wrench. If you don't heed 100/500mi advice, at least paint!

You'll need to observe some considerations if you go up a notch on those struts, each notch = 1/2-3/4" lift. Be prepared, anything over an inch, you may sling grease, and you'll want extended swaybar links (go SuspensionMaxx). If over 2", start thinking about new UCA - now there's a fun job.

Anyway, good on ya, again, for sticking this out. I'm proud you didn't give up when shit didn't look right. We've all been there at some point. How you choose respond is the most important part and says a lot about your character.

 

PS -

Relish in the fact you just saved yourself at least $500, that's what a basic shop around here would've charged for the same labor to replace both LBJ and both struts. Maybe it'll help with the mental justification of splurging on something else

 

Thanks!

I think I’ve ended up spending at least $300 on more tools. I haven’t gone back to add it up yet. But that was also to replace the rear shocks and add the 1” lift. And part of that was some really good jackstands (6 ton) that will come in handy again and the torque wrench. I needed a new good torque wrench anyway

And most of that will come in handy when I do the timing belt myself

so even with all of those extra expenses by the time I get done with the timing belt, I’m sure it will be well over 500, probably over 800 saved

but more importantly, it’s the piece of mind. Because every damn thing I’ve had done by professionals lately when I go back over, it’s been half assed (like the sway bar connectors and bushings). Even my damn stereo I got fed up with one stereo shop and the 2nd one did much better but they still did something Jack leg and I had to go behind them and correct (bypassed the bad wiring harness, but you couldn’t takeoff the door panel without cutting speaker wires).

i’ve already spent two hours on the other side, but it was really going smooth. Just having a damn tough time with Breaking the ball joint loose. I’ve got a lot of pressure on it right now and put Something on to soak overnight. I’m gonna see if that doesn’t help in the morning. If not, I’ll go use the loan-a-tool at auto zone and get a better ball joint remover

 

That's always the goal: If you can spend less on proper tools than you'll spend having a shop install, you're ahead of the game. You just need the confidence to do the work. Confidence comes with hands-on experience and success.

You have a Harbor Freight nearby. I know people shit on their stuff "made in China garbage!" but if you're not pro, and don't rely on it for your income, that's a great option for things that are always otherwise made in China: multi-piece ball joint separator kits, pitdman/idler arm pullers that are helpful for steering stuff, etc. My recommendation for you on that arm is to go to HF and buy a kit with a puller. You won't spend as much. And they usually have coupons either in the store or online you can print out and either get discounts or freebies. Never pay full price there!

Oh, and busting ball joints loose is a bitch. Pitman arms on older vehicles can be a bear too. But if you have a decent cordless impact and a puller kit, it makes life hella easier. Gets you fat and lazy

 

Pittman arm puller? There are numerous choices. I saw someone else in the forum recommend that, but that was just one random find




I picked up the one below yesterday, and it worked great for the driver side and for the tie rod connectors. But I can’t get it wedged into the ball joint enough on the passenger side. In fact, it popped with a big spark and flew about 7 feet

 

Man, HF prices have definitely climbed.

I hit their website. I basically have the 2nd and 3rd kit in this list, but the much older (like 20yrs+) older versions, so half as many pieces. My front end service set is 3pc, my tie rod set aka 'pickle fork' set is also 3pc, but I have a couple of hand-me-down forks also. The 3rd one, the pickle forks, are great for separating ball joints, tie rod ends, or similar, for cases when you DGAF about the part, i.e. it's not getting reinstalled, you just wedge it into the seam and hammer until things separate. The 2nd one is ideal for cases where you need to separate, like, LBJ, TRE, I used to separate my UBJ from the knuckle, etc. But also works on pitman arms and idler arms. You'll notice the 4th option, pitman arm puller (we don't have pitman arms, too new) is also included in the set for option #2.

The reality is, if you never think you'll be doing this, just rent a set from the store.

 

I tried a pickle fork. I have it hammered all the way in and it still hasn’t popped loose

 

Stubborn bastards sometimes. Sometimes whacking the outer edges of the eyelet - while that doesn't fully make sense at first glance - can help break chemical/force bond.

But ultimately, the pullers in the 5pc front end kit are what I'd resort to if hammering and pickle fork won't get you there.

Are you having trouble getting it out of the LCA side, or popping out the TRE?

If it's the end that's in the LCA, backing off the castle nut off so ~3 threads are showing, then jacking the truck up at the crown nut may provide ample upward force, then if you tap the rim of the LCA eyelet, it may be the 1-2 punch you need.

If it's the TRE end, the kit up there 2nd search result would help push it out, but typically speaking, a couple of good whacks on the eyelet part of the LBJ will get there, like you see at 1m10s mark here - and this is basically what I'm saying is effective with the LBJ, but tapping the eyelet on the LCA while putting upward stress on the LBJ post - but keeping the castle nut on is important, so the whole truck doesn't drop 2" when it breaks free! Always try hammering first before bringing a jack into the picture and DO NOT let the jacking lift your truck off the jackstands, if you do, that's too much!:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nry13mJpTPI#t=1m10s

 

LCA side. I’ve left it jacked up pulling on the LBJ assembly but I should’ve thought about doing it directly on the castle nut.

I’ll try that one two punch you mentioned in the morning before I go get that tool set

 

I'll just reiterate again - put the castle nut on fully, hand-tight. Then back it off 2-3 threads. Just enough so that, when it breaks free, the nut acts as a 'stop' to limit movement. Safety first!

Consider this one of those, "dude who always gets stuck wrenching on his own and needs extra hands" tactic.

 

I just tried that and it didn’t work. I couldn’t put the castle nut on because when that other puller broke free and flew about 7 feet, it broke off a piece of the end of the stud

i’ll just have to get the pullers in the morning

 

I happened to find this old thread,

https://www.tundras.com/threads/possible-05-06-fsm-lbj-x-knuckle-torque-misprint.72731/#post-2755949

they discuss the issue of the differing torque values Toyota printed

they seem to conclude it should be 59 and I tend to agree so I’m gonna have to go back in the other side and torque mine down more since I chose the lower value of 48. Besides, I forgot to put the lock-tite on it

but that’s OK because I was going to go back and take the cotter pin off and recheck the LBJ crown nut. I triple checked everyone but that one and I started doubting myself I’m about 98% positive I torqued it correctly, but that 2% doubt on front suspension just will never work for me

and yes I did go back and back off the nuts on the u-bolts for the rear leaf springs and then retorque in the star pattern slowly tightening with each nut for the rear leaf springs like I told you. There was one that had a few more threads showing and it didnt after I redid it so I feel better

I guess sometimes OCD is good

PS if possible, you might edit your sticky about 1st GEN’s and mention that discrepancy. that’s a fairly significant issue IMO. Otherwise people are gonna keep either messing up, or at best, being confused

 

Is it OK to reuse the castle nut on the tie rod end? @shifty`

my other side has a new one, but I’m thinking that came with the new tie rod end I picked up from the Toyota dealership Friday

 

I've never had an issue with re-using castle nuts, with a couple of considerations:

• Threading matches and is in good shape, i.e. not jamming up a couple threads in
• None of the 'crowns' are torn/missing/excessively bent
• The notches fit the cotter as snugly as the other side you've got to compare

I've got a number of them in my nuts and bolts bins and wouldn't personally hesitate to pull any of those out to re-use in a pinch. YMMV.

 

I went ahead and started with it just so I could keep making progress knowing I could replace it if needed

I was afraid it was stripped but now I see the stud is spinning. I didn’t have that problem on the other side, but I know there are some things I can do to compensate

 

So, that may be an indication the castle nut is grabbing for one reason or another. The ball spindle is supposed to do that: Spin. This is why it's important the threads aren't stretched and the crown pieces aren't bent inward: The castle nut is supposed to have threads loose enough it requires less resistance to install the nut than it would for the ball spindle to spin in the socket.

This is also why, when threading on the nut to hammer/whack on shit, it's best to flip the nut upside down, so the hammer doesn't bend the crown pieces inward (if you need to re-use the nut, at least). Little late to share this tidbit.

EDIT: Do you find it's starting to grab when you're getting to where the crowns start?

 

yes, that’s where it started. But I didn’t bang on that one and it does not appear damaged


By the way, I didn’t have to get another tool this morning. After fighting it for a while, I jacked up again on the end of the ball joint stud and raised the LCA 2 or 3 inches and then I was able to use the fork bar to pop it out

 

Typical. I'm assuming the crowns are a little inward. Others may have advice in this case.

Anything you can do to make the TRE put pressure into the eyelet will stop the spindle from spinning. Does that make sense, and is it an option for you?

Grabbing the shank with something like needlenose Vise grips may impact the threads in a way that make it difficult to thread the nut further, so ... I would avoid that.